Random GPF's

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Random GPF's

Postby SteveLeighton » Sun Aug 01, 2010 11:11 pm

Greetings

We are running TD5.1 PTF6. Recently upgraded from TD4.2. Either SQLBase 9 and 11.5 .

Just one particular app we run is giving GPF totally randomly - but centered around a form with 15 Tabs build with QuickTabs.

Worked fine in TD4.2. Now, the app will GPF either after the first Tab click, or after upto 25 clicks on any of the 15 Tabs.

Crashes in either exe or app - but never consistantly in the same place.

Strangely, it ONLY occurs in Win XP and Server2003 ( both 32 bit ) !
If we run it on Win2008 Server ( 64 Bit ) the exact same exe NEVER crashes.


So far I have :
    Checked GDI objects - appear to be no leaks
    Merged all the apl's , opened in Text editor - there are no old dll's - they are all *51.dll
    Removed all population of Tab data ( this appears to stop the problem - or maybe delay it )
    Replaced SendMsg with PostMsg
    Compiled in all the different themes - ( Office2003 eases the problem - but not totally )
    Office 2007 is worst - it usually crashes after one click any tab.

Attached is the core dump , which identifies offset 0006e350 in cdlli51.dll consistantly, albeit the GPF occurs randomly.

We do run many other apps with QuickTabs - but no GPF's ( less Tabs though )

Any assistance as what else I could check - greatly appreciated. Sorry I cant attach the app - merged its 23Mb

Thanks alot for any help !
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Best wishes
Steve
Bankside Systems Ltd. ( New Zealand )
http://www.banksidesystems.co.uk
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby tlauzi » Mon Aug 02, 2010 6:07 am

Unify/the support staff usually offers, to send the application source by private mail (not here attached in the public forum) to them/the development for analysis.
Best Regards,
Thomas L.
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby Jeff Luther » Mon Aug 02, 2010 2:59 pm

Couple thoughts:
** FIRST, save a backup of your source!

** Try to isolate that form down to a single form case. If you can get a small test case that fails it can be looked at.

** Save as non-indented text, then comment the quicktab, save the app. Close TD/reopen the app. and now uncomment the quicktab, force a rebuild with menu Component/Refresh Libraries, and run it. OK now?

My guess is that the migration, however you did it, might not have converted correctly. If you still have the v4.2 source (hope you do!) compare the picTabs from non-indented 4.2 source with non-indented 5.2 source at that section.

Comment/uncomment might fix it if this is the issue, otherwise you might have to...
** (In your small test case, hopefully) comment out the quicktab that's the problem and recreate it in v5.2.
Jeff Luther
 

Re: Random GPF's

Postby SteveLeighton » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:22 pm

Jeff Thanks for your suggestions. Unfortunatley, no amount of refreshing the quicktabs as you suggest , or saving as Text etc seemed to work. The GDI count is consistant at around <= 800 , The User Objects count consistant around 900.
Very strange that we have no problems running the exact same exe / app on Win2008 server.
There are no rogue references to TD4.2 in the registry.
Rewriting the QuickTab is not really an option either - its BIG. 15 Tabs with around 30 objects on each incl. Table Windows etc.
I've run the exe through Dependancy Walker - it highlights IMHOST32.dll , bmutil.dll , IESHIMS.dll and WER.dll as missing - but these are way down the tree and so does the 4.2 exe which works fine.

Sometimes after say around 20 clicks of random Tabs, then exit the Tab dialog, the app will crash on the event immmediatley preceeding the re-creation of the Tab. But it is absolutley random.

This is really hurting us now. So would really appreciate any other ideas.
Attached is the output from ProcessMonitor a couple of clicks prior the crash - note IMHOST32.dll is mentioned here also, but no idea if these are related.
Regards.
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Best wishes
Steve
Bankside Systems Ltd. ( New Zealand )
http://www.banksidesystems.co.uk
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby Jeff Luther » Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:21 pm

Out of ideas... Can't recreate, can't comment/uncomment to get it to work, can't reduce the app/quicktab to a test (?) It's a 'black box' otherwise, and we need some way to peer into it... :?

Did you try comment/uncomment? Or is that what you call 'refreshing'?
Jeff Luther
 

Re: Random GPF's

Postby tlauzi » Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:34 am

"There are no rogue references to TD4.2 in the registry"
-**Not in the registry in the application source. It could happen, that references are not (Class default) but hard coded inside a control and they get not converted, when migrating to a new version. Search the sourcecode in editor for dlls of the prior TD version ( e.g. *42.dll )

Like Jeff said....
-**Try to isolate the window to a fresh app and strip what is not needed but the crash still occurs and post the source of the window here for analysis.

-**Use WinDebug to find out where the crash occurs!! (We had randomly crashes in TD4.2 and when I cleared a outlinelistbox. I did not know from where it came. I used WinDebug and this showed me a GPF in a VisList... function. With this I was able to control the problem)

**Whats about testing the more recent version TD5.2 SP1?
Best Regards,
Thomas L.
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby SteveLeighton » Wed Aug 04, 2010 8:25 pm

Thanks but I've already merged all apl's , converted to text and searched for *.dll - nothing other than *51.dll and the WIN API's.
I will try WinDebug though.
Because of the high volume of data and high object count , I cant really reduce down to a test case - it would solve nothing if there were no crash, other than tell me we have too much processing going on for QuickTabs v Win2003 memory management. ( no crash on Win2008 ) , which I cant do much about.
Thanks. I will try WinDebug.
Best wishes
Steve
Bankside Systems Ltd. ( New Zealand )
http://www.banksidesystems.co.uk
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby tlauzi » Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:36 am

Are the tabs defined in a form window class or are they defined in the form window template?
when the tabs are in a class try to put them in the from window template. this solved me in prior TD versions a lot of problems.
Best Regards,
Thomas L.
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby SteveLeighton » Tue Aug 10, 2010 3:48 pm

Yes the Tabs are defined in a Form Window Class. I will try and rebuild just as part of a standard Window Template. Seems like progressing backwards considering it only happened when we 'upgraded' to 5.1 . Thanks.
Best wishes
Steve
Bankside Systems Ltd. ( New Zealand )
http://www.banksidesystems.co.uk
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby SteveLeighton » Tue Aug 17, 2010 3:38 pm

Thomas This was a really good idea ! Your solution worked. A nested class based Dialog with many Quick Tabs on it struggles with memory. or something. I reduced the Dialog containing the Quick Tabs down to a single base class ( rather than a class that was derived from many others ) , rebuilt the Tabs, and the issue dissapeared.
Thanks again Thomas.
Best wishes
Steve
Bankside Systems Ltd. ( New Zealand )
http://www.banksidesystems.co.uk
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Re: Random GPF's

Postby tlauzi » Mon Aug 23, 2010 12:23 am

Hello Steve,

nice to hear and that the tip helped and your program now works.

Sometimes TD programming is more experience (about the magic and bugs from inside) than logic ;-)
I only know it so well, because it also costed me a lot of days and solved the problems in three independent cases.

->Since this days, I started to program more "flat" with quicktabs and not derive so much (more than 2 levels) and I never got problems like these again.

But what me makes a like bit sad is, that this old bug is still inside :-(
Best Regards,
Thomas L.
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Posts: 196
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:26 am
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